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T O P I C
Where is Everybody?
March 25th 2004, 00:40 CET by Charles

So, as you've probably all noticed, the site has been deader than Hulka's week old dirty socks lately.  What gives?  Did you all go out and have babies?  Did you all follow Jibble to the altar to get married?  Are you stuck in a third world country with no net connection?  Are you cheating on planetcrap?

Think of this a roll call.  Where are you, and what are you up to?  Come back to us!  The many can give you comfort.

(Note:  Voting yes for this topic will bump the monster topic off the bottom of the front page.  'sup DKI)
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#147 by yotsuya
2004-03-25 16:56:59
Apparently, the guy that Simmons slapped is a professional cage fighter.

That's a beautiful way to go. Shot by Yot. In more ways than one. -mgns
#148 by CheesyPoof
2004-03-25 17:05:04
3 high quality, AAA releases in a month isn't significant?

I'm just wondering what the 8 were.  Yes, it's significant, but all it means to me is that I won't play them.  As much as I want UT2k4 for $20, I have a 3 game backlog.

Oh, I remember another one, BF:Vietnam.  That's four.
#149 by Charles
2004-03-25 17:05:45
www.bluh.org
Huh. Something like eight mid-to-high profile games released in the past month, and people keep saying nothing is happening in the industry.


Okay, I can count four.  Far Cry, UT2k4, BF:V, and Pandora Tomorrow.  What are the other four?  The first three have been talked about, and the last was talked about a year ago when it was called Splinter Cell.

Religion is the most malevolent of all mind viruses.
#150 by yotsuya
2004-03-25 17:06:14
You fuckers forgot SETH's Puzzle Adventure.

That's a beautiful way to go. Shot by Yot. In more ways than one. -mgns
#151 by Matthew Gallant
2004-03-25 17:16:25
http://www.truemeaningoflife.com
Since we're talking mid-to-high profile releases: CounterStrike: Condition Zerizzle, Sacred, the Rainbow Six 3 expansion pack, and of course, Scooby Doo: Monsters Unleashed. Does Nemesis of the Roman Empire count?

"All I've ever wanted to be is a monkey of moderate intelligence that wears a suit. That's why I'm transferring to business school!"
#152 by Hugin
2004-03-25 17:22:02
lmccain@nber.org
I already talked about the Far Cry demo a fair amount, but I wasn't moved to buy the game so I won't discuss it much.  I've talked a goodly amount about UT2K4. I dislike BF1942 and the very mixed/lukewarm reviews of BF:V aren't going to change that, so no discussion there.  And I played the Pandora Tomorrow demo and talked about it quite a bit in IRC, but I'm willing to repeat myself here in compressed form:


My perceptions of "stealth" in an action/espionage setting come from TV, movies, anime, comic books.  In those media, incredibly cool people move through the darkness, disappear in one shadow and come out of another, get chased into rooms by enemies yet somehow get behind them, bypass guards like a ghost, slaughter enemies before the enemy even know they're there, and are generally scary badasses.

In stealth games, I always feel like an extraordinarily weak, vulnerable about-to-be victim, cringing at every noise, fearing even the lowliest guard, and concentrating less on how cool I am or how well trained I am, and more on hoping that the light meter or the noise meter or some caprice of the guard AI routine or some scripted or unscripted FUBAR doesn't expose a pixel of my ass at the wrong moment and cause me to fail the mission.  All of this happening at glacially slow speeds, because you can't ever run or do anything dynamic, no, for stealth games it must be timid creep creep creeping.

That's Pandora Tomorrow for me, at least the demo.
#153 by UncleJeet
2004-03-25 17:23:25
I'd be happy with it if it would allow a consequence of detection to be anything other than instant failure.

I'm fighting terrorism by playing violent video games!
#154 by Bailey
2004-03-25 17:24:23
Fine, fine. Mid to high profile: UT2K4, Far Cry, BF:V, Pandora Tomorrow, Rainbow Six 3, CS: Condition Zero, Dead Man's Hand... alright, there were seven, and SETH's Puzzle Boxes make eight.

And if there's any reason PC gaming is dying, it's cross-platform release. Making a game work for the Xbox means it's pug-ugly on my PC.

My continued existence is purely to spite any sense of fairness in the universe.
#155 by Bailey
2004-03-25 17:25:25
Dammit MattG, why must you rain on my teddy bear parade?

My continued existence is purely to spite any sense of fairness in the universe.
#156 by UncleJeet
2004-03-25 17:30:01
Hrmmm, maybe if they outfitted your character with the Dagger of Time the game would be more fun.  Detection!  Instant failure?  Oh, I don't think so....rewind time!  Also, he could run on walls.

I'm fighting terrorism by playing violent video games!
#157 by Hugin
2004-03-25 17:32:40
lmccain@nber.org
Don't even get me started on stupid PoP.
#158 by Bailey
2004-03-25 17:33:02
I think they call the Dagger of Time the Quicksave Button of Quicksaving in Pandora Tomorrow.

My continued existence is purely to spite any sense of fairness in the universe.
#159 by jjohnsen
2004-03-25 17:35:24
http://www.johnsenclan.com
I've never even heard of Dead MAn's HAnd.

I don't understand the adoration of FarCry almost as much as the love of Ninja Gaiden escaped me.


I was enjoying Far Cry until the monsters became a large part of it.  Suddenly I have an enemy 10x faster and stronger than the old one, but I have the same old weapons.  Not to mention the fact they have an enormous reach, and are somehow able to hit me while still 5 feet away.

The outdoor areas are amazing, the indoor areas could be any other game.  Maybe I was having too much fun with UT2K4, and should have held off buying anything else for a while.

-Jeremy
#160 by Bailey
2004-03-25 17:37:51
I've never even heard of Dead MAn's HAnd.

Well it's winning meaningless award from whore websites, so I guess it's mid-profile!

My continued existence is purely to spite any sense of fairness in the universe.
#161 by UncleJeet
2004-03-25 17:39:30
I just don't see the graphical wowness of FarCry that everyone else seems to.  It's pretty yeah, but even with everything maxed out it doesn't really wow me in the slightest.  Maybe it's just that the demo didn't showcase anything special, though.  I guess I'll have to get the game....maybe.

I'm fighting terrorism by playing violent video games!
#162 by Matt Perkins
2004-03-25 18:00:27
wizardque@yahoo.com http://whatwouldmattdo.com/
I just don't see the graphical wowness of FarCry that everyone else seems to.  It's pretty yeah, but even with everything maxed out it doesn't really wow me in the slightest.  Maybe it's just that the demo didn't showcase anything special, though.  I guess I'll have to get the game....maybe.

You weren't wowed by the demo, so your solution is to buy the full game...

"...he related the story of how when they first put all the creature AI in place in Black & White, the hungry creature walked around in circles acting strange before they realized it was trying to eat itself. " - Peter on B&W
#163 by UncleJeet
2004-03-25 18:02:44
Well, maybe the demo didn't showcase all the amazingness that everyone seems to keep talking about.  A lot of times, demos will use lower resolution textures and lower quality sounds, sometimes leave out entire chunks of stuff, you never know.  I can't be so jaded as I can't at see what's so pretty about the graphics, can I?

I'm fighting terrorism by playing violent video games!
#164 by Duality
2004-03-25 18:06:02
Dualipuff@yahoo.com http://stratoscape.ath.cx/
#82 jafd
I suspect the lack of noise is due to people playing it, instead of talking about it.

I suspect the lack of noise is due to the people waiting for the fucking thing to be delivered!!

#92 Matt Perkins
Two, people refuse to talk about politics, god, or anything else that might be an interesting topic, because it has already been talked about...lame.

I admit, I'm rather surprised no one has brought up the 9/11 Commission questioning from the last couple of days.  Or Richard Clarke's book.  All enlightening stuff.
#165 by Matt Perkins
2004-03-25 18:18:12
wizardque@yahoo.com http://whatwouldmattdo.com/
I admit, I'm rather surprised no one has brought up the 9/11 Commission questioning from the last couple of days.  Or Richard Clarke's book.  All enlightening stuff.

All quite interesting...but that's exactly my point.  Someone will bring it up, someone will say "we've already talking about." and it'll be dropped.  Discussions are not wanted here...  Now mind you, I'm not complaining about PC, I like PC, but overall, you guys don't like to discuss things so much as whine about them until it's dead and then quit talking about them FOREVER.  imho.

"...he related the story of how when they first put all the creature AI in place in Black & White, the hungry creature walked around in circles acting strange before they realized it was trying to eat itself. " - Peter on B&W
#166 by jjohnsen
2004-03-25 18:22:01
http://www.johnsenclan.com
Two, people refuse to talk about politics, god, or anything else that might be an interesting topic, because it has already been talked about...lame.

I admit, I'm rather surprised no one has brought up the 9/11 Commission questioning from the last couple of days.  Or Richard Clarke's book.  All enlightening stuff.


I think its too bad that instead of them learning what went wrong, and making changes, we're going to get politics.  It seems like Bush should take this as an opportunity to learn what they did wrong, and improve things.  Instead they will just attack each other until they reach a stalemate and nothing gets fixed while they shout "partisen politics" at one another.

-Jeremy
#167 by bago
2004-03-25 18:27:52
manga_Rando@hotmail.com
It also seems that Clarke is his own worst enemy when it comes to credibility.


JIM ANGLE: You're saying that the Bush administration did not stop anything that the Clinton administration was doing while it was making these decisions, and by the end of the summer had increased money for covert action five-fold. Is that correct?

CLARKE: All of that's correct.


The monkey poured coffee in my MOOTZ!
#168 by Matthew Gallant
2004-03-25 18:30:23
http://www.truemeaningoflife.com
It's a bizarre and uncomfortable feeling to click the word "credibility" and be whisked away to NewsMax.com.

"All I've ever wanted to be is a monkey of moderate intelligence that wears a suit. That's why I'm transferring to business school!"
#169 by BobJustBob
2004-03-25 18:32:08
If any of you guys really miss the athiest debate, it's currently going on over at Qt3. Beyond that, I'm going to get a headstart on the future and say that PC gaming will die again very soon.

Dood.
#170 by Bailey
2004-03-25 18:32:25
The Far Cry graphics don't really wow you until you're hang-gliding over a tropical canyon with sparkling blue waters and pristine white sandbars a few hundred feet below you. Or better yet, over a moonlit half-mile of battlefield with explosions and tracer fire lighting up the ground beneath you. But the in-game cinematics really show off the detail of the character models, and despite some stiff facial animation, you can begin to see how engines like this are going to make games look like that Final Fantasy movie in the near future. By which I mean five to ten years.

My continued existence is purely to spite any sense of fairness in the universe.
#171 by Caryn
2004-03-25 18:33:10
carynlaw@pacbell.net http://www.hellchick.net
I loved the religion debate here. I like discussing politics. I already know I'm not likely to agree with someone who has strongly different opinions than mine, but that doesn't mean that interesting, thoughtful discussion can't come out of it. Good debaters around here on those subjects may not have changed my opinions, but they'll often give me a couple of really good things to think about that make me pause and say, "you know, I never considered that as a point before."

I think the fact that those debates can get so heated is what makes them so interesting. So what if people argue about it? That's the whole point of a discussion board. Personally, I'm up for more controversial subjects like that if it'll get people talking about interesting things, although I do think that people too easily fall into the, "how much of a moron can you be?" style of arguing, which is a dead end. You can disagree vehemently with someone without calling them an idiot and get some good conversation out of it.

And just because we've discussed politics or religion before doesn't mean we can't discuss it in a new frame of reference, i.e., the 9/11 commission or the Clark book or things of that nature.

"See, Canadians believe Jesus walked on water. We just figure it was winter when he did." - Squeaky
#172 by CheesyPoof
2004-03-25 18:33:38
Bush must go.  But I don't like Kerry.

I don't get Clarke.  One one hand he says Bush had a lower (not low) priority on terrorism than Clinton.  This paints Bush as being weak and dropping our guard against terrorism to open the door for Sept 11.  However, under questions, he admitted that if Bush adopted his suggestions they still could not have prevented the Sept. 11 attacks.  So what does he get by throwing the mud around?

It does not surprise me to find that terrorism was a lower priority with Bush than Clinton.  One of his campaign promises was to reopen up traffic on Pennsylvania ave in front of the White House*.  Clearly he didn't think of terrorism as that big of a threat.

* His mother and the secret service convinced him to reverse that position.
#173 by jjohnsen
2004-03-25 18:43:01
http://www.johnsenclan.com
My problem with what Clarke is saying is the same problem I've heard before.  Right after 9/11 happened the Bush people were looking for a way to tie it into Iraq, even if nothing pointed to it.  Clarke may lack some credibility, but that isn't the first member of his administration that has accused Bush of it.

-Jeremy
#174 by The_Joker
2004-03-25 18:45:53
http://www.jackinworld.com
You stupid fucks are now discussing things I have told you years ago!

Joker, Ph.D. Procedural Assholian Behaviour, Pedophilosopher
- All your ass are belong to my wang Jafd. Prepare to are penetration.
"I fart in THX." - Sgt_Hulka

PENETRATOR: Rise of the Wang Cuming "When it's done".
#175 by BobJustBob
2004-03-25 18:50:29
And Qt3 has a save-anywhere debate raging as well. Everything over there is new and fresh!

Dood.
#176 by Squeaky
2004-03-25 18:51:35
#138 CheesyPoof
I'm still here, much to Yotsuyas chagrin.  I don't post much at home,  I never seem to get on the computer anymore and when I do I'd rather play games.

Huh. Something like eight mid-to-high profile games released in the past month, and people keep saying nothing is happening in the industry.

Let me see how many I can come up with.  UT2k4, Far Cry, Splinter Cell, and that's it.  I can only think of 3.  Either I'm out of touch, or these releases aren't much.

And one of those is in fact, a console game with a PC port.

I love the Power Glove. It's so bad.
dvds
#177 by Post-It
2004-03-25 18:55:52
keithlee@speakeasy.net
The only problem is that the majority of the folks (Minus PCers of course) over at Qt3 are overblown, head-in-the-ground, I'm not listening-lalalala egostistical jackasses. Nothing is indie or obscure enough for them. Unless you are an ardent fanboy of a WWI sim that came out 8 years ago with a 200 page manual, obviously your taste in gaming sucks.

Comment Signature
#178 by haplo
2004-03-25 18:56:36
Game news,
 I am still avidly playing Star Wars Galaxies


Glad I am not the only one.

<@jafd> Anyway, Darth, your name is stupid. sry.
<@Ashiran> So no more darthnugget?
<@haplo> darthnugget has left the building
#179 by Ashiran
2004-03-25 18:58:15
Nothing is indie or obscure enough for them. Unless you are an ardent fanboy of a WWI sim that came out 8 years ago with a 200 page manual, obviously your taste in gaming sucks.

So that's why there was so much foaming over Dominions 2 over there.

Cloggy is watching you.
#180 by haplo
2004-03-25 19:12:00
In other news:  Pandora Tommorow MP demo released.

<@jafd> Anyway, Darth, your name is stupid. sry.
<@Ashiran> So no more darthnugget?
<@haplo> darthnugget has left the building
#181 by Chunkstyle
2004-03-25 19:13:42
I tried Star Wars Galaxies again recently.  Other than the land speeders zooming around it was the same old Tatooine.  I felt no urge to stay.

Life is full of misery, loneliness, and suffering - and it's all over much too soon.
 -Woody Allen
#182 by Charles
2004-03-25 19:14:08
www.bluh.org
Jade Empire is looking pretty sweet.  Also looking like they copied a lot of Soul Calibur animations almost directly, but hey.  At least they are stealing from something good.  

I'm putting the GDC video up on my ftp, so if people want it they can swing by IRC.

Religion is the most malevolent of all mind viruses.
#183 by Bailey
2004-03-25 19:22:15
The Pandora Tomorrow MP seems spotty in design, from what I've read. 2 vs 2, stealth vs firepower?

My continued existence is purely to spite any sense of fairness in the universe.
#184 by Duality
2004-03-25 19:25:17
Dualipuff@yahoo.com http://stratoscape.ath.cx/
#166 jjohnsen
I think its too bad that instead of them learning what went wrong, and making changes, we're going to get politics.  It seems like Bush should take this as an opportunity to learn what they did wrong, and improve things.  Instead they will just attack each other until they reach a stalemate and nothing gets fixed while they shout "partisen politics" at one another.

Unfortunately.  The media isn't helping any, either.  While they go on and on about what Bush's administration did wrong, they're going to completely overlook the things Clarke said about Clinton's administration with regard to dealing with terrorism and al Qaeda -- something his book doesn't do much.  The media's going to let it look partisan and its going to devolve into childish bickering between Clarke and Condie Rice.

#172 CheesyPoof
One one hand he says Bush had a lower (not low) priority on terrorism than Clinton.

Its my understanding that it only looks that way because his book focuses specifically on the Bush administration, and not American counter-terrorism policies of the last 6-8 years in general.  Its not that he attempted to make the Clinton administration look any more pro-active, because his testimony damned them pretty clearly as well.
#185 by Bailey
2004-03-25 19:40:58
Hrm... I don't know Charles, the animations and poly count in Jade Empire still look a little spotty. Are they going to port it to PC like they did with KOTOR?

My continued existence is purely to spite any sense of fairness in the universe.
#186 by Darkseid-D
2004-03-25 19:40:59
rogerboal@hotmail.com
Far Cry should make Valve and id nervous, a beautiful game engine, smidgeons of physics and believable behaviour, semi intelligent AI and freeform gameplay.

This is NOT a john rambo game, you cannot expect to succeed if you go in guns a blazing (unless like Bailey you have godmode on). Tag people with the binoculars so they show up on your radar, work your way from cover to cover, moving QUIETLY, using thermal vision to watch them through the bush. Flank them and either bypass them or take them out quietly, the MP5-SD (silenced 9mm machine gun) lets you drop them quietly without revealing your position.  Scanning the area ahead and thinking is essential, there are often snipers and LAW toting hostiles dotted around watch towers and bunkers, make too much noise (ie use the m60 or any of the assault rifles on full auto) and they'll zone in on you and kill you.  The interior levels are fine, believable layouts, audio background, pitching a rock around the corner to make hostiles turn and look so you can sneak past (or shoot them in the back of the head).

But Im with Bailey on another thing, the game can be incredibly restful, with the graphic options cranked up, some of the vista's are gorgeous. From the light streaming through the ferns and palm fronds putting a zebra stripe light pattern on your gun (that changes as you move), to sitting on the beach watching the water ripple  and lap on the shore. Popping out in the middle of a firefight and taking a 'safe' viewpoint as you watch the two sides battle it out, tracers ripping past, grenades throwing dirt around, screams reverberating and corpses cartwheeling past.  Sliding around corners in the jeep barely in control and accidentally running people over, sailing through the air with tracers screaming past. Hang Gliding around the islands, trying to balance your height against speed, hearing the thwop thwop of a helicopter coming up on you.

In many ways, Far Cray feels like Half Life did when I played it back in the day, tense, terrifying, funny, new and surprising views.

Do not go gently into that good night.
Old age should burn and rage at the close of day.
Rage, rage against the dying of the light.
#187 by Your Friend
2004-03-25 20:14:26

3 high quality, AAA releases in a month isn't significant?


And yet all three together would be lucky to sell as well as one mediocre console game.

PC gaming is dead.

Comment Signature
#188 by UncleJeet
2004-03-25 20:19:39
See, all this talk about retail FarCry just isn't in the demo.  Why release a demo that features blehness in every regard?  I can understand holding most of the "wow's" back for retail, but you should put at least some redeeming factor into your demo or a lot of people might very well never buy the game.

I'm fighting terrorism by playing violent video games!
#189 by Neale
2004-03-25 20:19:48
neale@pimurho.co.uk www.pimurho.co.uk
Run along then.

9 years later you're the fat kid with his face pressed against the window of The Industry. - crash
#190 by Charles
2004-03-25 20:21:13
www.bluh.org
Hrm... I don't know Charles, the animations and poly count in Jade Empire still look a little spotty. Are they going to port it to PC like they did with KOTOR?


No idea, I'm pretty much out of the loop nowadays.  But considering it's MS publishing, I think it's safe to assume Xbox only.

Religion is the most malevolent of all mind viruses.
#191 by UncleJeet
2004-03-25 20:23:38
PC gaming won't die so long as developers don't start trying to mimic console gameplay or, worse, simply port console games back and forth between the.....er, wait.  Fuck.

I'm fighting terrorism by playing violent video games!
#192 by MCorleone
2004-03-25 20:24:00
I don't think CryTech or whomever created the game is worried about the game revenue - The game will most certainly sell engine licenses.  That's where da money be.

Never been much of an 'ass' guy.  I'm all about the titties.  And if you happen to be female and reading this (and have nice titties), please replace 'titties' above with 'smile' or 'eyes' or something.
-YF
#193 by gaggle
2004-03-25 20:25:41
I'm completly floored by Darkseid-D's tellings of Far Cry. I speak from the demo, so maybe I missed something quantifyinly important, but I thought the graphics were just kinda okay. The water looked kinda hot I supposed, but other than that it was just okay. Not exactly ugly, but.. the buildings, the models, the characters, they didn't seem special to me.

Add to that what I thought was awfully boring AI, and shoot-and-run gameplay, and I was bored out of my mind within 15 minutes. The AI spewed the exact same lines over and over again if you sat and listened to them, and the reward for sneaking up on them was completly nonexistant. You could come close, even if it meant having to listen to their repeated sentences, but when you shot them pretty much everyone was alerted anyway, so why bother. The enemies were so easy to pick off at a distance anyway the whole thing seemed mood.

The whole game quickly devolved into looking at my radar, if I saw an enemy I would crouch or prone towards them, until either they magically spotted me or I saw them, I killed them, and moved on to the next radar blip. There's a stair you have to get up, protected by snipers. The whole area was clearly marked by enemy blips, so you crouch thru' some grass, pick enemies off as they come running down the stairs eager to be killed, then smack the snipers (I think the crosshair turned a color when over an enemy? I think I could see the snipers through the trees..). Zero immersion along the way, what-so-ever.

And added to that you have the awful voiceacting to go with a game for a long time, it just weren't clicking for me. The chopper and aircraft were nice additions, but the Half-Life Apache had more of an impact. These guys just sorta spat a few bullets around your general area and flew away when they took damage. Or alternativly crashed before landing a single trooper. Exciting!


I categorized Far Cry as yet another wannabe FPS, all glitz and no content. I really really though it bland.

And I have absolutely no idea how on earth Darkseid can come to such a violently different opinion. It almost makes me all wound up, like he's lying to my face. Obviously he's not, it's just.. such a different opinion.
#194 by Ergo
2004-03-25 20:29:27
gaggle--

I agree with Ds. I pity your jadedness.

MY FATE KEEPS INTERFERING WITH MY DESTINY. THAT IS KARMA.
DVDs
#195 by lwf
2004-03-25 20:31:48
I'd be interested in the PT MP Demo if it came out before the immersion release of the full fucking game. Which hopefully CD3 will be done when I get home today.

Maybe you guys (Bailey, Hugin) and cranking up the difficulty but I have no problem at all sneaking around in Splinter Cell, as long as you keep relatively in the shadows you can get by with very little trouble, and even if you're spotted/heard (assuming you don't jump up and down yelling "FIRE!") the enemies usually just scratch their head and wander leisurely in your direction, at which point you can even lead them around in fucking circles if you want to. I don't feel like a baby seal crawling around waiting to be clubbed at all, I feel like Sam motherfucking badass Fisher and I'm going to come up behind this guy and give him such a fucking clubbing, then I'm sneaking over to buddy's bunk and prescribing a hot lead injection to the right temple, ensuring he don't wake up.

I played a little Far Cry last night and it looks really good, the different render modes are neat, though cartoon is fairly impractical. I didn't get very far and it ran kind of badly for me but it shows promise. UT2K4 is alright I guess, I won't be buying it because I just know that there won't be anyone I like to play with in the next two weeks. That's what I'm excited about in Pandora's MP, I only need to get 3 people together to play a packed game! Have you guys checked out all the gear you can use in it? It sounds awesome on paper, and I can't wait to give it a try and take care of the whole learning curve thing.

I am way too giddy.

For the next time you must redefine something.
#196 by jjohnsen
2004-03-25 20:43:33
http://www.johnsenclan.com
And I have absolutely no idea how on earth Darkseid can come to such a violently different opinion. It almost makes me all wound up, like he's lying to my face. Obviously he's not, it's just.. such a different opinion.


He's played the full game?  I don't feel like I did when I first played Half-Life, but it is fun.  I stood in a room shooting at a swinging light for a while to watch the shadows bounce around, kinda neat.  I think it gets hard too fast(or else its pretty short and I'm almost done).  Hangliding past a river, towards the beach showed me how good looking the game was.  Still, I always end up talking about the graphics more than the gameplay, which is the best way to describe my overall feeling about it.

-Jeremy
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